From: Larry Chin (
Date: Wed Aug 19 1992 - 11:51:36 CDT

Yesterday I posted a SUMMARY re vtam-tcpip. I neglected to post the individual
answers with that summary ( doing too many things at once ). Anyway here they
are, sorry for any inconvenience.

Larry Chin {} CCH Canadian Ltd.
System Administrator 6 Garamond Court
Research and Development Don Mills, Ontario.
(416) 441-4001 ext. 349 M3C 1Z5

Mr. Cole's Axiom:
        The sum of the intelligence on the planet is a constant; the
        population is growing.


From: <@Relay.Prime.COM,>

We're running TCP/IP software on some of our IBM mainframes. It's nice for
being able to communicate with the Sun workstations. It supports Telnet and
FTP as well as a number of other support services (such as an LPR/LPD interface
and DNS nameserver). Optionally, there is also a VMNFS component which
provides NFS-server capability (although the performance isn't great and
there are some major limitations based on the IBM filesystem structure). The
Telnet capability supports TN3270 for fullscreen terminal emulation.

The following is some information provided by one of our IBM folks in response
to a similar question that I posed recently regarding interconnectivity for
one of our International locations.

Hope you find it useful.

John Kilheffer
Project Software Engineer
AMP Incorporated (EMCS)


  o 3172-001 3172 Interconnect Controller w/
             2501 Parallel Channel Adapter
             2220 IBM Interconnect Controller Ethernet Adapter
             approximate list price is US$ 23,000
  o 5601-400 IBM Interconnect Controller Program (for the 3172)
  o 5735-FAL TCP/IP V2 for VM
  o 5688-188 IBM C/370 Library V2.1
Optional Software:
  o 5688-004 SQL/DS 2.2 or later if you want to run the Nameserver
              other than caching only.
  o 5668-717 IBM VS Pascal V1.2 if running VM/XA Exploitation mode
              (XA virtual machines greater than 16M)
  o If you have an ES/9000 or IBM 9370 you can use the Integrated
    Communications Processor in place of the 3172 controller.
  o The host software will require at least 40MB DASD and 7MB user
  o Approximate software costs are dependent on the model group of
    the CPU, I did not list an estimated price.
  o I would advise you to contact your local IBM branch office
    and have them run their hardware/software configurator prior to
    ordering any items on this list.
  o Ungermann-Bass Ethernet adapter is only valid for an 8232, they should
    order their Ethernet adapter from IBM.

From: Gregory Higgins <>

I haven't looked into it, nor do I know the gory details . But I don't see
how you need to do anything, the IBMs need to speak TCP/IP or you need to
have a gateway between the two.

Since IBM has already figured out how to do this (their RS/6000 is TCP/IP
based) the mainframers should ask their IBM rep what hardware and software
they need on their side to implement the connection.

Worst case scenario - an RS/6000 sits between your network and theirs
and provides the interconnectivity.


From: Christian Lawrence <>

I'm not an IBM head either but have dealt with this some on an MVS mainframes.
Don't know all the details (e.g. cost) but I think you need 3 things :

VTAM version 4.1 (or later ???)
MVS TCP/IP 1.1 (or later ???)
3172 controller - ethernet interface thats channel attached to big blue

We use this here and it works like a champ. The MVS/TCP/IP package gives
you the telnet, ftp, NFS, and SMTP servers so you can do quite a bit with
it. It also comes with an API for those fools interested. The early versions
had performance problems but after 3 or 4 years I think they got it figured out.


From: era@niwot.scd.ucar.EDU (Ed Arnold)

We used to run an IBM product called FAL on a 4381 here. The 4381 ran
the VM/CMS OS. It talked to ethernet thru, as I recall, an 8232 controller.

Most people here weren't too happy with FAL, and the 8232 was not stable.
The danged thing had to be reinitialized fairly frequently. (Fortunately,
we don't have to put up with it anymore.)

If you want more detailed info about it, you can email Marla Meehl

Ed Arnold * NCAR * POB 3000, Boulder, CO 80307-3000 * 303-497-1253(voice)
303-497-{1298,1137}(fax) * internet: * bitnet: era@ncario


From: (Peter Gutmann)

VTM/VTAM is a piece of the operating system. I believe that it has something to do with allocation of the virtual machine for the OS...

there are several different protocols that "mainframes" support...

I know that there are a bunch of options.

1 - There are channel attach devices (sun boards that connect directly to the i/o bus of the mainframe) then a UNIX machine would be a gateway to the mainframe environment.

2 - LU 6.2 is a peer to peer network protocol (with the functionality of RPC's built in).

3 - there is a company called Vitalink (Freemont CA 800-443-5740) that claims to have SNA <-> TCP/IP gateways.

Hope that this helps. We are doing 3270/SNA and 3770/SNA to the mainframe and we will be doing IP later (in about a year)...


From: Mark.McIntosh@engr.UVic.CA A company's products that I am considering for System/36 5250 to TCP/IP gatewaying is Mitek OpenConnect Systems. They supply other IBM connectivity solutions also. You might try them.

Mitek OpenConnect Systems 2033 Chennault Drive, Carrollton, TX 75006 (214) 490-4090 FAX: (214) 490-5052

I'd appreciate receiving a summary of other IBM to TCP/IP connectivity vendors you hear about.


From: "Brian K. Dore'" <>

IBM supports TCP/IP on their mainframe line of computers. You will need a box that channel attaches to the mainframe that handles your ethernet connection. We use the IBM 3172, but I've heard that you can use a SUN or RS/6000 workstation as a replacement.

The TCP/IP software for the Mainframe is 5735-FAL for VM and 5735-HAL for MVS. We use it on VM and are quite happy with the product. You can also get third party interface boxes, as well as third party TCP/IP software for the mainframe if you would rather not go through IBM.

We are an educational institution, so our cost on this stuff is a lot less than most people would pay, so I can't really tell you much about it. Your local IBM rep will probably jump through hoops to get you information on this stuff. If there are any questions that you want to ask me, feel free.


From: Chris Keane <chris@rufus.state.COM.AU>

This response is a bit nebulous, but I know (have seen with my own eyes) an ethernet board in a 9370 with TCP/IP running under VTAM. Yes, you can telnet, ftp etc to it. Personally, distasteful as it seems, I'd get in contact with your local IBM marketroid about this one...


From: stern@sunne.East.Sun.COM (Hal Stern - NE Area Systems Engineer)

VTAM is the virtual terminal access method. think of it as a big wad of telnet config scripts and /etc/ttytab files. VTAM runs over the SNA network, which is really your TCP/IP equivalent.

at the network layer, you have SNA: SDLC serial lines running block mode protocols to terminal controllers. when you power on a terminal, VTAM kicks in and gets the backend configured, just like getty kicks in and sets your tty line discipline defaults.

the real cost is deciding what to do with the equipment on the SNA network today. if it's 3270 terminals, and you can replace them, great - go to wyse terminals hooked up to terminal servers and unix servers acting as routers/login hosts. but this is a big change -- if you need to keep the 3270s around, there are some options (ibm makes some firm/software for the terminal controller that lets you put it on token ring). you could put TCP/IP up on your mainframe.

the other possibility is to leave the SNA/VTAM side alone (probably *VERY* likely if you're using the IBM stuff heavily) and just tie the suns into the mainframe for terminal access. sun will sell you a channel attach board (so you can pretend to be one of those terminal controllers), NJE/RJE software, SNA 3270 and bisync protocols, etc. you could run an SDLC line between a sun host and an IBM channel controller, and pretend to be a remote SNA site.


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