From mnjwestover at gmail.com Mon Mar 3 00:15:38 2008 From: mnjwestover at gmail.com (Matthew Westover) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 22:15:38 -0700 Subject: SUMMARY: Changing controller numbers in /dev manually Message-ID: <3bb293dd0803022115p50ec644bw494567d3962e96f2@mail.gmail.com> Many thanks to Stuart Saxon, Marion Dragomir, Darren Dunham and Matthew Stier. As this problem was a bit odd, it turned out to that there are very few solutions. Ultimately, the device tree builds from /etc/path_to_inst when a devfsadm is called, either manually or during a reconfig reboot. So, if the device history isn't cleaned up before hand, getting two sites to look exactly the same is difficult. The only real option is to boot to CD or another device and rebuild the device tree using the path_to_inst from the system you're attempting to emulate. This may require some creative editing of /etc/path_to_inst to fit your actual paths should they differ even slightly. Otherwise, you'll just renumber the devices as they'll be seen as new from the OBP to path_to_inst pass-off. Also of note that I was only concerned with the disks and therefore only had them reconfigured. ok> boot cdrom -s ... (path_to_inst.extract expected to be pulled from source system's /etc/path_to_inst) # mount /dev/dsk/cXtXd0s0 /a # rm /dev/dsk/* /dev/rdsk/* # devfsadm -c disk -p /a/etc/path_to_inst.extract -r /a There are obviously more elegant ways to accomplish this, but seeing as I only need to do this the once, I'm happy enough with this method. Disclaimer: make sure you're comfortable with /etc/path_to_inst before changing paths and devices in the file. Thank you very much!! Matthew Westover On 6/18/07, Matthew Westover wrote: > > Hello Gurus! > > I've been looking for an answer to this, but I can't seem to phrase the > question properly. I need to change a controller instance in the /dev device > tree to another number manually: > > e.g. /dev/dsk/c2tXd0sX to /dev/dsk/c4tXd0sX > > I know about devfsadm -C to clean up entries, I can disconnect the arrays > and start fresh, but I need an absolute assurance. Without doing it > manually, I can't get that. I've tried looking around a bit in > devlinks.tab and devices.tab, tried manually changing files and links in > /dev to no avail. > > SunFire 280R, Solaris 8 02/04, with fully populated StorEdge D2. > > Any help anyone can give would be greatly appreciated and I'll post a > summary after answered. Thanks! > > Matthew Westover _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From lrandy.webb at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 18:08:11 2008 From: lrandy.webb at gmail.com (Randy Webb) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 17:08:11 -0600 Subject: Summary: Start Jumpstart Locked With Verbose Option Message-ID: The -v has to be BEFORE the - Thanks to Darren Dunham for pointing this out. On Tue, Mar 04, 2008 at 04:08:08PM -0600, Randy Webb wrote: > In order to start a jumpstart in a 100 Locked full network environment I > have used > boot net:speed=100,duplex=full - install Right... > In order to start a jumpstart with a verbose option I have used: > boot net -v install Does that get handed off properly? I would have expected * boot net -v - install to be necessary. * > Does anyone know how to combine these. I am troubleshooting a jumpstart and > need more output but a simple > combination such as: > boot net:speed=100,duplex=full -v install (* wrong)* > > does not seem to work. Hm. I would assume that would act identically to the previous one (with the exception of setting the network parameters). What way does "not seem to work" mean? network problems? verbose problems? install problems? > Neither does: > boot net:speed=100,duplex=full - -v install > Have tried multiple times with different systems ( v440 , 490, 240, T2000) Again, what is the behavior? * I would expect you'd need the -v to be interpreted by the kernel, so it has to be before the lone dash.* From ashok.karagatla at hp.com Wed Mar 5 14:41:53 2008 From: ashok.karagatla at hp.com (Karagatla Lankala, Ashok Kumar) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 19:41:53 +0000 Subject: SUMMARY: Solaris 9 RAID 1+0 Message-ID: <9BD2583AADEA4541860E14B39D2D332C014744204E13@G1W0492.americas.hpqcorp.net> Hi , Please provide me the steps to configure the Raid 1+0 on solaris Thanks & Regards, Ashok kumar Karagatla From s4r3sh at yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 13:57:56 2008 From: s4r3sh at yahoo.com (suresh sandasani) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 10:57:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: SUMMARY: Networker doesn't start Message-ID: <457549.92204.qm@web90604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Thanks to all who responoded but the EMC engineer who was installing at our site compared with a working server and found a Solaris package(SUNwuiu8x 64 bit) was missing . Networker was able to start after installing SUNwuiu8x. Thanks /Suresh ----- Original Message ---- From: suresh sandasani To: sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org Sent: Tuesday, March 4, 2008 2:21:44 PM Subject: Networker doesn't start Hello All, After installing Legato Networker Server 7.4.1 on Solaris 9, it fails to start with the following error: "Function 'iconv_open' failed for UTF-8 to ANSI conversion. The function may be unable to determine the current locale. Verify appropriate values in environment variables LC_MESSAGES, LC_ALL and LANG." Installing the following package couldn't help. system SUNWuiu8 Iconv modules for UTF-8 Locale Any HELP ? Thank you! Suresh ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From grove at zeta.org.au Thu Mar 6 10:41:40 2008 From: grove at zeta.org.au (grove at zeta.org.au) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 02:41:40 +1100 (EST) Subject: SUMMARY: remote X displays fail after Solaris 10 upgrade Message-ID: Hi, Thanks to: Glenn Prince Peter Kunst The following document has advice on this problem: http://blogs.sun.com/gbrunett/?entry=solaris_secure_by_default_part2 Solaris 10 0606 and beyond has a new "secure by default" mode, that I have never seen as I usually Jumpstart everything and the DVD install seems to be the only place where there is an option to enable/disable the modes at install time. I actually said "Yes" to the prompt which mentions rather obliquely that network services to the system will be disabled except for SSH but doesn't describe the actual impact. Once I found the blog above, it was pretty straightforward. I was hoping this info would be in SunSolve, but it's not - having to hunt down an external blog to get this info is a bit annoying. Thanks again to everyone who assisted me. The actual solution is below and I also had to enable RPC and one or two other things as well. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 11:20:33 +1000 From: Glenn Prince Subject: RE: remote X displays fail after Solaris 10 upgrade Well if you don't want it in SBD mode anymore you could do a: /usr/sbin/netservices open And then do a /usr/sbin/netservices limited to switch it back. If you do want to enable just the xserver stuff but leave it in SBD mode then you should be able to do the following cmd: svccfg -s x11-server setprop options/tcp_listen = boolean: true Hope this fixes it. Glenn -- Rachel Polanskis Kingswood, Greater Western Sydney, Australia grove at zeta.org.au http://www.zeta.org.au/~grove/grove.html The price of greatness is responsibility. _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From henson at acm.org Fri Mar 7 14:51:51 2008 From: henson at acm.org (Paul B. Henson) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 11:51:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: SUMMARY: Solaris package installation for Oracle server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A number of the people who responded to my inquiry requested a summary, so here it is... There were 14 relevant responses. Of those, 9 indicated they currently do custom installs both in general and 7 of those for Oracle specifically (two responders did not manage Oracle servers). Five responses indicate they currently do full installs in general and for Oracle. Of those, four indicated they would prefer to do custom installs, but due to package dependency issues and lack of support for automatic dependency installation in the Sun package tools it is not tractable. There was some rather impolite commentary on the quality and attitude of Oracle support :). The general consensus seems to be that minimization is better, but not everyone has the time to spend the effort on it, particularly given issues like packaging tools and products like Oracle. Thanks to everybody who commented... -- Paul B. Henson | (909) 979-6361 | http://www.csupomona.edu/~henson/ Operating Systems and Network Analyst | henson at csupomona.edu California State Polytechnic University | Pomona CA 91768 _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From ksonmez at oytek.com.tr Tue Mar 11 08:04:14 2008 From: ksonmez at oytek.com.tr (Koray Sonmez) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:04:14 +0200 Subject: SUMMARY: remote connection failed In-Reply-To: References: <96E68311E829E147865DC064BE1346CF014683A4@oytexc01.oytek.com.tr> <96E68311E829E147865DC064BE1346CF014683A8@oytexc01.oytek.com.tr> Message-ID: <96E68311E829E147865DC064BE1346CF014683B2@oytexc01.oytek.com.tr> Problem solved. The partition(s) , which specifiy "mount at boot" in /etc/vfstab file, not mount at boot, closes network services . comment problem line in /etc/vfstab file reboot and after reboot mount partition. On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 11:21 AM, Koray Sonmez wrote: Hello, In my solaris 10 system i cannot connect with ssh telnet and ftp. I got same erros ssh: connect to host port 22: Connection refused Re: telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Connection refused Does anybody have an idea? Regards, Koray Bu e-mail'in tum icerigi gonderenin kisisel tasarrufu ile olusturulmus ve gonderilmistir. Oyak Teknoloji Bilisim ve Kart Hizmetleri A.S. bu e-mail icerigi hakkinda sorumluluk kabul etmez. This e-mail has been sent by the sender under his/her own individual discretion. Oyak Teknoloji Bilisim ve Kart Hizmetleri A.S. accepts no responsibility. _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From CJohnson4 at tiaa-cref.org Tue Mar 11 11:49:22 2008 From: CJohnson4 at tiaa-cref.org (Johnson, Chad) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 12:49:22 -0400 Subject: SUMMARY: prtvtoc | fmthard -s - in wrong direction, any fix? Message-ID: <50BFA7C0BA27F345BE28A21B7BE7D3340A01A039@CHAPDMSXMB04.ad.tiaa-cref.org> An identical system was discovered and the 'prtvtoc' output was used from that system to initialize the disk via 'fmthard'. Once that was completed the remainder of the work was a straightforward SDS disk replacement. Sunmanagers, One of our admins was replacing a disk and performed the following command backwards. prtvtoc /dev/rdsk/c0t0d0s2 | fmthard -s - /dev/rdsk/c0t1d0s2 this should have been: prtvtoc /dev/rdsk/c0t1d0s2 | fmthard -s - /dev/rdsk/c0t0d0s2 I am currently searching to find out the previous slice boundaries for the 'good' disk. At this point running (while booted to the net in single user) fstyp /dev/dsk/c0t1d0s0 returns 'unknown_fstype'. Any suggestions on recovery methods aside from re-installing? At this time I do not know if I can recover the previous slice table or not. Chad Johnson TIAA-CREF Distributed Server Engineering Office: 704-988-4565 Mobile: 704-607-6233 SSC/8625/E1/S4 ***************************************************************************** *************** This message, including any attachments, contains confidential information intended for a specific individual and purpose, and is protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender immediately by reply e-mail and destroy all copies. You are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or distribution of this message, or the taking of any action based on it, is strictly prohibited. TIAA-CREF ***************************************************************************** *************** _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From grimland at uta.edu Tue Mar 11 13:37:49 2008 From: grimland at uta.edu (Grimland, Courtney) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 13:37:49 -0500 Subject: SUMMARY: Solaris 9 Kerberos Problem In-Reply-To: <9A9F358293FF2641A70B4A0AC7D082F3282872@MAILFS2.uta.edu> References: <9A9F358293FF2641A70B4A0AC7D082F3282872@MAILFS2.uta.edu> Message-ID: <9A9F358293FF2641A70B4A0AC7D082F328287E@MAILFS2.uta.edu> Sun support pointed me to an existing bug report (CR 6608799*) that I never would have found on my own, which basically boils down to a bug introduced in patch 112908-30 that has yet to be resolved. I had to back out 113318-33, 112908-31, and 112908-30 and Kerberos authentication started working again. *http://bugs.opensolaris.org/bugdatabase/view_bug.do?bug_id=6608799 -----Original Message----- From: sunmanagers-bounces at sunmanagers.org [mailto:sunmanagers-bounces at sunmanagers.org] On Behalf Of Grimland, Courtney Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 12:08 PM To: sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org Subject: Solaris 9 Kerberos Problem I posted this a while back but never found a solution, and it's getting to be a serious problem for me. Kinit used to work, but at some point (which I can't pin down) it started failing and I have no idea where to begin: _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From peter at ashlyn.co.uk Thu Mar 13 05:10:57 2008 From: peter at ashlyn.co.uk (Peter Stokes) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 10:10:57 +0000 Subject: SUMMARY - Need a copy of SPARC Solaris 10 11/06 Message-ID: <47D8FDB1.3060500@ashlyn.co.uk> Hi All As ever this list does not let you down. I had several offers to send/download, thanks to you all, it was appreciated. I managed to obtain a copy locally in the UK from a list member. All the best Peter Hi All I am looking for a copy of SPARC Solaris 10 the 11/06 release (this is required for a specific application). If anyone can let me have a download site or would cut me a copy that would be great. I am happy to reimburse any expenses or purchase the media kit if you have it. Thanks Peter Tel: +44 1636 627900 _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From DRoss-Smith at reviewjournal.com Thu Mar 13 15:55:28 2008 From: DRoss-Smith at reviewjournal.com (DRoss-Smith at reviewjournal.com) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:55:28 -0700 Subject: Summary swap rules. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Summary- I was asked nicely to not post these types of questions in the future because it's off topic for this list. The list is supposed to be more of a break/fix type of list and not an informational list(didn't know until I read the faq). That said, this topic was pretty popular. And for those who want to see what sunmanagers.org is about, read the FAQ. It has lots of useful links on it pointing to lots of solaris based admin stuff (finally read it today- it's good!) So it looks as if swap is mostly not used anymore and can be kept pretty small. Unless you're running an application that uses lots of swap or tempfs. Examples of needing swap were systems compiling lots of stuff and databases. Favorite posts: Tim Bradshaw stated what I privately felt- that 1:1 swap to memory is becoming impractical on largish systems given the size of boot disks- this is what I'm facing now... sizing swap for 32 gb intel blades and a 64gb niagara2 blade w/73gb boot disks. Seems a bit tight to do a 1:1 swap to memory ratio. Jeremy Gillow's answer got to the heart of the matter with sun documentation for solaris 10... read on below. Dean Ross-Smith Unix Admin Las Vegas Review Journal/Stephens Media. ------------ The person who mailed me saying my question is off topic, also mentioned that Oracle 10g recommends 8GB minimum swap. Kiran Sharma wrote: " I think there is some math goes. If ram is more then 4 gb then swap is 4gb. I think its upto ggb ram 4 gb swap. 16gb ram 8 gb swap. 32 ram==>> 16 gb swap. Thats what I did for Redhat server we had and also for 880 and t200 server. " Dave Kensiski wrote: " I have systems with 12 to 16 GB of RAM and as a rule just make my swap a fixed 4GB space. As you said, we don't actually use swap on a day-to-day basis (in fact, I have Nagios configured to alert me if it gets used at all!) so it's really only around for memory leaks and core dumps. Unless you have a really fast memory leak, 4 GB should provide you enough time to do some diagnostics before you restart the leaky application, and it's certainly enough for an OS core dump. " Ric Anderson wrote "I'd say a disappearing standard. System dumps seem to just include the kernel and a hand full of data structures - no where near all of RAM. What drives my decision is how much virtual address space (ab)users will need. Since Solaris computes VM Size = RAM+Swap these days, I try to get enough RAM to hold all the resident sets for applications, and then let swap space absorb the VM needed beyond the resident set size (with some extra space in both to allow for growth and for kernel overhead). " Matthew stier wrote " This is an old BSD vs SVR4 issue. You can run a Solaris 2 or later system without swap; and if you do add some, it is simply used to increase the systems virtual memory. Personally, I do setup a 20GB swap partition on the large memory systems I do have, simply because the disk is available, and it is a place for the kernel to stash a core during a crash. " Peter van Gemert wrote " Solaris 9 & 10 do not followi the old UNIX way of allocation memory of reserving memory against physical memory. This UNIX way was the mean reason for configuring a swap partition twice the size of your internal memory. Solaris 9 & 10 (and I believe 8 as well) allocate memory against virtual memory. This means that if you know for _sure_ that you have enough memory so that swapping will not occur, you might configure Solaris without any swap partitions at all. Solaris will then run completely from internal memory without any problems. Biggest caveat is of course crash dumps (which you call core dumps I think) which are written to swap space. If you want to save crash dumps you could have a swap partition large enough to hold the largest crash dump. Another solution might be saving crash dumps in a reserved partition. Take a look at the dumpadm command how to do this. " Tim Bradshaw wrote: " It's typically now becoming impractical to provide as much swap as memory on many machines - lots of systems have 72GB boot disks (may be 146) but much more memory than that. The only things you *need* swap for are to deal with memory shortfalls (should be very rare, and if you get significant shortfall you have other problems), and crash dumps. Even on huge systems crash dumps are not often bigger than a few GB, since all you really need is kernel storage, and often not all of that. So I don't generally see much use for swap slices bigger than, say 16 or 32GB and often much smaller (4-8GB should be more than enough for most things). There are probably weird exceptions. " Jeremy Gillow wrote: "Sun has a reference guide http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-5093/6mkisoq7g?a=view 4GB swap is the max we usually do now, but if you are in the 16-128gb range 8GB would be better I think. " Jeremy's referenced document is: "Solaris 10 System Administrator Collection >> System Administration Guide: Devices and File Systems >> 20. Configuring Additional Swap Space (Tasks)" ---snip--- The most important factors in determining swap space size are the requirements of the system's software applications. For example, large applications such as computer-aided design simulators, database management products, transaction monitors, and geologic analysis systems can consume as much as 200b1000 Mbytes of swap space. Consult your application vendors for swap space requirements for their applications. If you are unable to determine swap space requirements from your application vendors, use the following general guidelines based on your system type to allocate swap space. System Type Swap Space Size Dedicated Dump Device Size Workstation with about 4 Gbytes of physical memory 1 Gbyte 1 Gbyte Mid-range server with about 8 Gbytes of physical memory 2 Gbytes 2 Gbytes High-end server with about 16 to 128 Gbytes of physical memory 4 Gbytes 4 Gbytes In addition to these general guidelines, consider allocating swap space or disk space for the following: b" A dedicated dump device. b" Determine whether large applications (such as compilers) will be using the /tmp directory. Then, allocate additional swap space to be used by TMPFS ---snip--- sunmanagers-bounces at sunmanagers.org wrote on 03/13/2008 07:44:19 AM: > Hi managers. > > What are the general rules for sizing swap on current systems? > As cheap as memory is getting these days the newer systems we are playing > with have 32 or 64GB ram. > Back in the day when memory was expensive, a 2:1 Swap partition size to > RAM ratio was pretty normal. > Then It was 1:1 as memory has gotten cheaper. > Is it still a good practice to do 1:1 to allow for huge core dumps on a > crash? > Or is 1:1 Swap:RAM a disappearing standard too because swap isn't used > much anymore? > > I'd be curious to hear from admins that run systems with under 128GB ram > and admins that run really large memory sun boxes too... how do you handle > swap on systems with a bunch of RAM? > > I'll summarize what I get back... > > Thanks all! > Dean Ross-Smith > _______________________________________________ > sunmanagers mailing list > sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org > http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From Ugo.Balestrieri at alcatel-lucent.it Fri Mar 14 09:45:20 2008 From: Ugo.Balestrieri at alcatel-lucent.it (BALESTRIERI UGO) Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2008 15:45:20 +0100 Subject: SUMMARY : libc.so.1 corrupted on Solaris 9 In-Reply-To: References: <997443.96147.qm@web65405.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <72B2DB3EB0EAE243B7613C6F00B7C16F278E8E@FRVELSMBS21.ad2.ad.alcatel.com> Message-ID: <72B2DB3EB0EAE243B7613C6F00B7C16F2B732B@FRVELSMBS21.ad2.ad.alcatel.com> Hi thanks to everybody answers I solved my problem with the following WA : at the ok prompt with the installation disk 1 of 2 (or the dvd disk) in the cdrom/dvd player ok> boot cdrom -s mount the / partiont (or /usr if you are using a non-standard partitioning) and copy the file. after I umounted /mnt and reboot now the server is up Bye Ugo Original question : Hi Managers I have Sun V250 with solaris 9 but after libc.so.1 corrupted file on single user mode I saved the original one but Is not possible run any unix command like mv and cp The server doesn't come up. Do you any suggestions please. Thanks in Advance Bye Ugo --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From george at yorku.ca Fri Mar 14 10:33:03 2008 From: george at yorku.ca (George Kahler) Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2008 11:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [SUMMARY] Sun Fire X4200 M2 cloning In-Reply-To: <20080128.204039.74752735.george@yorku.ca> References: <20080128.204039.74752735.george@yorku.ca> Message-ID: <20080314.113303.41635239.george@yorku.ca> It appears that my previous summary post did not make it out to the list. My appologies for that. There were well over dozen replies which most suggested to use flash archive. The flash archive can be created from the source server, then I can boot the new target server from a CD/DVD and select to install the flash archive. Many thanks to all who replied. George On Mon, 28 Jan 2008 20:40:39 -0500 (EST), George Kahler wrote: > I have a number of SunFire X4200 M2 x64 servers that require Solaris > 10 x86 to be installed on them. I have installed and configured all of > the software on the first server. > > Q: has anyone figured out a way to (perhaps use the built-in LSI RAID > controller) clone these servers ? > > BTW, PXE/jumpstart is not an option at this time. > > Thanks, > George _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From matthew.taylor at montgomerycollege.edu Fri Mar 14 13:42:42 2008 From: matthew.taylor at montgomerycollege.edu (Matthew Taylor) Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2008 13:42:42 -0500 Subject: Summary: Starting Solaris Management Console Server Message-ID: All; Working with Sun I determined that the problem was that SMC under Sol 10 is regularly being broken by a patch or patches unknown. They are working on a fix. The short term fix was to shut down wbem and a bunch of related services, remove 23 packages, reinstall the packages in a very specific order, enable wbem via svcadm bounce the box, remove the .smc.propterties file, re-enable wbem, and bounce the box one more time to test. Sun provided a not for dissemination script and a tar ball of the need to reinstall packages. The packages were (and this formatting will probably stink): SUNWmc SUNWpmgr SUNWwbmc SUNWadmj SUNWmcc SUNWrmui SUNWwbpro SUNWdclnt SUNWmccom SUNWwbapi SUNWwsr2 SUNWjsnmp SUNWmcdev SUNWwbcor SUNWlvma SUNWmcex SUNWwbcou SUNWlvmg SUNWmga SUNWwbdev SUNWlvmr SUNWmgapp SUNWwbdoc This solution is evolving so anyone with a similar problem I suggest should talk to Sun directly as today's solution might not fit tomorrow's problem. Original Post: I am feeling rather stumped trying to do what should be simple - run the Solaris Management Console. The SMC seems can not detect a server running. My web searches have proved less than fruitful. A fresh full install of Solaris 10 8/07, patched through a week ago on an older 4800, updated firmware (5.20.6 build 01). As soon as I start the smc I get: "No Solaris Management Console server was available on the specified server. Please ensure there is a Solaris Management Console server available on the specified host and that it is running." So, lets make sure wbem is running: bash-3.00# /etc/init.d/init.wbem status Solaris Management Console server not running on port 898. That could be the problem so we try to start it and check again: bash-3.00# /etc/init.d/init.wbem start bash-3.00# /etc/init.d/init.wbem status Solaris Management Console server not running on port 898. Ok, so it does not appear to start though it returns no error. For yucks and grins we check for wbem as a service and find: bash-3.00# svcs -a | grep wbem online 11:36:18 svc:/application/management/wbem:default It does appear to be running? Really confused now, we check netstat: bash-3.00# netstat -a |grep 898 localhost.898 *.* 0 0 49152 0 LISTEN Ok, so is it running, or is it not? If not, why might I see what I see? If it is running, why won't the smc detect a running server? Any help appreciated. -- Matthew Taylor Montgomery College Office of Information Technology 240.567.3100 matthew.taylor at montgomerycollege.edu _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From osama at myrealbox.com Mon Mar 17 09:48:07 2008 From: osama at myrealbox.com (Osama Ahmed) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:48:07 +0200 Subject: NOSUMMARY: Solaris Kernel tables utilization Message-ID: <1205765287.4069789cosama@myrealbox.com> I received no answer. I tried to google but found nothing. It seems that Solaris did not have this type of advanced monitoring tools. Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: "Osama Ahmed" To: sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 20:47:15 +0200 Subject: Solaris Kernel tables utilization Hi, I came from HP-UX world. In HP-UX there are commands to check the utilization of kernel tables like shared memory , number of file descriptorsb&(kcusage) My question: - Any native Solaris commands to list all and check the utilization of kernel tables/limits ? - Any other 3rd party tools to check if kernel parameters needed to be reconfigured or increased ? I will summarize. Thanks. Osama _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From ghenry at cmi.univ-mrs.fr Mon Mar 17 10:57:47 2008 From: ghenry at cmi.univ-mrs.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=E9rard_Henry?=) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:57:47 +0100 Subject: Summary: name resolution issue in solaris 10 In-Reply-To: <47D957D6.5040800@cmi.univ-mrs.fr> References: <47D957D6.5040800@cmi.univ-mrs.fr> Message-ID: <47DE94FB.7080905@cmi.univ-mrs.fr> thanks to darren dunham, rob mcmahon, crist clark, andrey borzenkov and kiran sharma for ttheir replies. the simpliest solution is to add FQDN in netgroups file: exports clientA clientB clientA (clientA,,) (clientA.my.domain.fr,,) clientB (clientB,,) (clientB.my.domain.fr,,) my original post > since few days, i've got an issue with machines name resolution on the > nfs server. > The nfs server (servA) is a NIS client (solaris 10 sparc 11/08), and > directories are shared with netgroups constraints. The nis map netgroup > contains all clients names (not fqdn names). It worked. > But now, nfs clients can't mount the shared dirs, because the nfs server > see requests from clientA.my.domain.fr instead of clientA: > servA-root% snoop clientA > Using device /dev/e1000g0 (promiscuous mode) > clientA.my.domain.fr -> servA TCP D=111 S=658 Ack=3984864805 > Seq=4069484885 Len=0 Win=7136 Options= > servA -> clientA.my.domain.fr MOUNT3 R Mount Permission denied > > When i use getent, i got the correct name: > servA-root% getent hosts clientA > 192.168.0.219 clientA > > /etc/nsswitch.conf contains: > hosts: files nis dns > > ans /etc/resolv.conf: > domain my.domain.fr > nameserver 192.168.0.23 > > The only thing i notice is that if i suppress /etc/resolv.conf, it works > . But in this case, this is sendmail that become broken! > > What is the right way to have nis resolution working? _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From leviashcol at hotpop.com Mon Mar 17 15:15:05 2008 From: leviashcol at hotpop.com (Levi Ashcol) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 22:15:05 +0200 Subject: SUMMARY: Solaris and SAN Connectivity Message-ID: Hello, Thanks to Ketan Patel Markus Mayer and Sengork. I found Ketan's email below contains the best SUMMARY. Markus suggested "Solaris Fibre Channel and Storage Multipathing Guide", part number 819-0139 from Sun, http://docs.sun.com/source/819-0139 . Sengork suggested a utility called emlxadm, this utility is not natively installed with Solaris. " The Emulex tools and drivers are provided by the EMLXemlxu package, which you can download from Emulexs website. The pkgadd utility can be used to install the package, and it will place the management tools under the /opt/EMLXemlxu directory." Thanks. Levi -----Original Message----- From: ketan.patel at uk.nomura.com [mailto:ketan.patel at uk.nomura.com] Sent: Friday, March 14, 2008 12:18 PM To: leviashcol at hotpop.com Subject: RE: Solaris and SAN Connectivity Hi Levi, I can answer a few of your questions: 1. If you are using Emulex/Qlogic provided drivers on Solaris, you don't need to install any Sun package. If you plan to use solaris drivers, then you should install Sun Storedge Traffic manager Software (or Sun SAN foundation). In sol 10, I think you don't need to install anything. Drivers are already integrated. 2. In order to determine the controller numbers, use the utilities provided by Emulex (lpfcutil) or Qlogic (scli). Or you can use cfgadm (a solaris command). 3. Same as above. 4. On switch, you need to create a zone comprising host and disk arrays. On disk array, you need to create lun and present it to the host. On host, you just need devfsadm. 5. you don't need to change /kernel/drv/sd.conf now a days. At least we don't do any more. The drivers are smart enough to figure out the controller number. You can use vendor utilities to give a particular controller number (same as plumbing the network interface). 6- What about the HBA configuration file lpfc.conf, qlc.conf ? Any needed changes ? No, unless you want a particular controller to be managed/not managed by drivers, or change time outs, or change number of retries, or load balancing policy. 7- How to know the WWID of the HBA? Vendor utilities should do this for you. From Sun point of view, you can run following script: #!/bin/sh for i in `cfgadm | grep fc-fabric | awk '{print $1}'`; do dev="`cfgadm -lv $i | grep devices | awk '{print $NF}'`" wwn="`luxadm -e dump_map $dev | grep 'Host Bus' | awk '{print $4}'`" echo "$i: $wwn" done Or command line: on all versions: #prtpicl -v -c scsi-fcp | grep wwn (On all versions) :node-wwn 20 00 00 e0 8b 94 92 8d :port-wwn 21 00 00 e0 8b 94 92 8d # prtconf -vp | grep -i ww port-wwn: 210000e0.8b80fb81 node-wwn: 200000e0.8b80fb81 On Sol 10 # fcinfo hba-port 8- Is the disk name "c10t60020F2000000CAA3DABB7B10001D2D4d0s2 function in SAN switch port and LUN ID ? What is the impact of changing switch port , LUN number on the storage on disk naming ? Once the ctds numbers are allocated, changing switch port etc should not have any impact on existing name - theoretically. Haven't came across that situation ever. The target number might be the UUID of the lun created on EMC. 9- What is the PWWN and NWWN? Let me know if you find out their difference :) I've usually seen them beginning with 20/21, 50/51. 10-Any good books or reference that fully explain Solaris-SAN connectivity? Learning by experience and google. We are talking about multiple vendors and different entities (sun, emc, Emulex, qlogic). It is difficult find a single document covering everything. You also need to figure out what multipathing you are going to use. There are various options - mpxio from sun, powerpath from emc, dmp from veritas. Drivers: Sun branded qlogic card - qlc, Sun branded Emulex card - emlxs, Original qlogic card - qla, original Emulex card - elmx Hope this helps. Don't forget to summarise for others. Cheers Ketan -----Original Message----- From: sunmanagers-bounces at sunmanagers.org [mailto:sunmanagers-bounces at sunmanagers.org] On Behalf Of Levi Ashcol Sent: 13 March 2008 18:32 To: sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org Subject: Solaris and SAN Connectivity Hi, I am new to connecting Solaris based servers to SAN. We are in the process of purchasing new EMC DMX storage and Qlogic/Emulex HBAs. I have some newbie questions and hope Gurus help me in them: 1- What is the necessary Solaris packages to be installed to connect to SAN ? 2- How I know which HBA in the server the fiber cable is connected to ? (I have c2, c3, c4how can I know which HBA the cable is plugged in ? 3- How to Check HBA-switch connectivity status? How can I know if the link is up or not ? 4- What should be done from the storage/SAN switch before working on the host side ? (Zone, masking ) 5- What are the necessary changes in the /kernel/drv/sd.conf file ? 6- What about the HBA configuration file lpfc.conf, qlc.conf ? Any needed changes ? 7- How to know the WWID of the HBA ? 8- Is the disk name "c10t60020F2000000CAA3DABB7B10001D2D4d0s2 function in SAN switch port and LUN ID ? What is the impact of changing switch port , LUN number on the storage on disk naming ? 9- What is the PWWN and NWWN? 10-Any good books or reference that fully explain Solaris-SAN connectivity ? I will definitely summarize. Thanks. Levi No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.518 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1327 - Release Date: 12-Mar-08 1:27 PM _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers This e-mail (including any attachments) is confidential, may contain proprietary or privileged information and is intended for the named recipient(s) only. Unintended recipients are prohibited from taking action on the basis of information in this e-mail and must delete all copies. Nomura will not accept responsibility or liability for the accuracy or completeness of, or the presence of any virus or disabling code in, this e-mail. If verification is sought please request a hard copy. Any reference to the terms of executed transactions should be treated as preliminary only and subject to formal written confirmation by Nomura. Nomura reserves the right to monitor e-mail communications through its networks (in accordance with applicable laws). No confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by Nomura by any mistransmission of this e-mail. Any reference to "Nomura" is a reference to any entity in the Nomura Holdings, Inc. group. Please read our Electronic Communications Legal Notice which forms part of this e-mail: http://www.Nomura.com/email_disclaimer.htm No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1328 - Release Date: 13-Mar-08 11:31 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1331 - Release Date: 16-Mar-08 10:34 AM _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From Crist.Clark at globalstar.com Mon Mar 17 19:00:08 2008 From: Crist.Clark at globalstar.com (Crist Clark) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 17:00:08 -0700 Subject: SUMMARY: How to Un-inherit-pkg-dir In-Reply-To: <47CFF502.8C45.0097.0@globalstar.com> References: <47CFF502.8C45.0097.0@globalstar.com> Message-ID: <47DEA395.8C45.0097.0@globalstar.com> Thank you to a number of respondents. However, I ended up just sticking with the method I outlined in my original message. I did a lofs mount of /opt/local over /usr/local all internal to the particular zone. One other solution a number of people sent me was a variation on that where you do the loopback mount from the global zone into the non-global zone using zonecfg(1M) commands, zonecfg:ainterdoc> add fs zonecfg:ainterdoc:fs> set dir=/usr/local zonecfg:ainterdoc:fs> set special=/opt/local zonecfg:ainterdoc:fs> set type=lofs zonecfg:ainterdoc:fs> end That way the global /opt/local gets mounted in the non-global zone. For my case, it didn't seem to offer any advantages over just doing it all internal to the zone, so I did not go that way. The other option two people presented was to ignore the zonecfg(1M) command's warning that "removing inherit-pkg-dir not allowed," and do so manually by editing the zone's configuration file. The file in question is the, /etc/zones/.xml File. Just look for the "inherit-pkg-dir" line for the file system of interested and remove it. My procedure would have been, 1. Halt zone. 2. Edit zone's XML file. 3. Copy /usr from global zone to the non-global zone. 4. Restart zone. But I opted not to go this way. I don't think the actual procedure would have caused problems, but the potential for future administration headaches when patching the system made me decide the loopback mount of /opt/local was the best way to go short of tearing down the whole thing and starting over. Thanks again fellow Sun managers. On 3/6/2008 at 1:43 PM, "Crist Clark" wrote: > I've got a non-global zone that has the default four > directories from the global zone set to inherit-pkg-dir, > /lib, /platform, /sbin, and /usr. However, now it is > turning out that we have some (poorly assembled) software > that is insisting on being installed in /usr/local. > Obviously, this does not work with /usr mounted as a > read-only loopback. > > My initial response was to bring down the zone, copy the > global /usr to the zone's /usr and then just un-inherit > the directory. However, the zonecfg(1M) is not allowing > me to un-inherit, > > zonecfg:ainterdoc> remove inherit-pkg-dir dir=/usr > Zone ainterdoc already installed; remove inherit-pkg-dir not > allowed. > > Is there a way to force the removal without destroying > (uninstalling) the zone? > > A workaround I've thought of is to do something like, > > # cd /zone/ainterdoc/root/opt > # (cd /usr ; tar cf - local) | tar xf - > > Then add an entry into the non-global zone's vfstab to > loopback mount its /opt/local over /usr/local. The > problem with this is that any future packages or patches > to things installed in the global /usr/local be inconsistent > in the zone. The files will not be touched, but the /var/sadm > database will. (Right?) > > As for future installations, anyone have a workaround for > this kind of problem so we can still share /usr, but have > /usr/local unique to the zone for broken software > installations? BB Hi all, Thanks to all for the reactions, especially to Brian D. Gregg and Casper Dik, who helped me in the direction of the fbconfig utility and the Xservers file. Also the manual Brian linked at http://docs.sun.com/source/819-3290-13/index.html helped me a lot ! The solution was indeed, as Brian said, adding a line in the Xservers file, pointing to port B, which is the DVI connector. :0 Local local_uid at console root /usr/openwin/bin/Xsun -dev /dev/fbs/pfb0b Did the job !! The DVI ouput in a res of 1152x900x60, showing a stable screen on the 22" Lenovo screen. I'm a happy chap now :-) cheers, Andy _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From sunhux at gmail.com Tue Mar 25 01:40:45 2008 From: sunhux at gmail.com (sunhux G) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 14:40:45 +0800 Subject: Summary: Checklist of files to move to new server/box (passwd, shadow, hosts, cron files, *.conf...) Message-ID: <60f08e700803242340x24e38dc1pd05e0935bd8b28e3@mail.gmail.com> Thanks to Chris, Ric & Murat & pardon my disorganized summary: Their replies added to my original email to make it a more thorough list : /etc/default/* ssh config & keys in /etc/ssh ftp access rules in /etc/ftpd /etc/ftpusers (as we used ftp besides scp in our environment) /etc/inetd /home/... or /export/home/... (ie users' home directories) /var/spool/cron/crontabs > We previously tuned /etc/system - can we just copy it over For 5120/5220/5240 CMT servers you'll absolutely need new /etc/system tuned for CMT servers. Extras : * If you collect sar statistics & if you may need them on new server : /var/adm/sa/sa* * User home directories to be copied may reside on /export. * In /opt there may be some optional packages. * If you use mysql you may want to copy /etc/my.cnf file. ... On 3/24/08, sunhux G wrote: > > Hi > > We're planning to migrate to another hardware T5120 > so we're coming up with a list of files that should be > copied over to the new box. Is there a checklist that > lists files/configurations that need to be moved across? > > > Offhand, I can only think of : > > a) files in /etc like passwd, group, shadow, hosts, hostname.*, > defaultrouter > resolv.conf (for DNS) > > b) what's the filename/directory which hold the cron table > for the various users (oracle, root, ...)? If I can copy them > over, that will be faster (rather than using root to "su - user" > & individually recreating their crontabs) > > c) .profile of root, oracle, ... > > d) most of the /etc/*.conf files are not touched, so we'll just use > what's given in the new server after Solaris 10 installation > > e) /etc/init.d/* startup/shutdown scripts & their links in /etc/rcX.d > > > Anything else? > > > Thanks > U _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From leviashcol at hotpop.com Fri Mar 28 03:09:08 2008 From: leviashcol at hotpop.com (Levi Ashcol) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 10:09:08 +0200 Subject: SUMMARY: Solaris Backups Message-ID: Thanks to Dean Ross-Smith, Tobias Nutt, Stan Horwitz, Ken Sibley, Chris H Ruhnke, Rich Kulawiec and Sengor. People suggestions were: 1 - Live upgrade: Can be used to clone boot disks. 2 - Flash Archive: Using flarcreate to create a system archive, store it on a jumpstart server and recover any failed server from the jumpstart server with this archive, use flarsplit you can expand the archive to single files and restore to the server from there but it isn't to use from the normal user. 3 - Dedicated backup package such as EMC NetWorker, Symanetec Netbackup (Bare Metal), and Commvault Galaxy might be considered with that large a number of servers. However with 3rd party network backup products and "bare-metal" recovery is that to recover a boot disk you have to install a bootable mini-root somewhere and then install the backup utility (or its local client). Then you can recover the boot disk filesystems.(recovery does not extend across mount points onto other drives beyond the boot drive). 4 - Ufsdump is the best tool as there is a massive amount of experience out there with it, so chances are any problem you'll run into has already been solved by someone else. 5 - Some backup pointers at http://www.solaris4you.dk/ . My choice will be option 3 as I have a large amount of servers and really need to automate and centralize the system backups. Thanks. Levi From: Levi Ashcol [mailto:leviashcol at hotpop.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 9:01 PM To: 'sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org' Subject: Solaris Backups Hi, I am working in the data center with more than 300 SUN servers of different class (entry, mid, high end) and Solaris versions 8/9/10. I am looking for a solution that can help in backup up Solaris boot disk (system disk) for all these servers with the possibility of restoring a whole server (in case of HDD failure) or a single system file from a specific server. I read something about flash archives but I guess It will not fulfill the requirements above. I will appreciate any pointer/3rd party SW/GUI interface/documentation. IWS. Levi No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1331 - Release Date: 16-Mar-08 10:34 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.22.1/1347 - Release Date: 27-Mar-08 7:15 PM _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From scottd at HanoverDirect.com Fri Mar 28 13:03:32 2008 From: scottd at HanoverDirect.com (Deiter, Scott) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:03:32 -0400 Subject: Summary: Solaris 10 upgrade. In-Reply-To: References: <96E68311E829E147865DC064BE1346CF014683A4@oytexc01.oytek.com.tr><96E68311E829E147865DC064BE1346CF014683A8@oytexc01.oytek.com.tr><96E68311E829E147865DC064BE1346CF014683B2@oytexc01.oytek.com.tr> Message-ID: Thanks for all the input. We have yet to decide about the live upgrade option. After a long service ticket with sun we finally ran truss against pfinstall. truss -faeildo /a/pfinstall.truss pfinstall -D /tmp/prof This show us that the file /a/kernel/drv/md.conf had entries from the last migration. We replaced the md.conf file with the default file that contains only comments. Now it's failing with other errors but at least it's attempting the upgrade. Scott Deiter System Administrator Hanover Direct, Inc. Hanover, PA Voice: 717-633-3298 _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers From sunhux at gmail.com Mon Mar 31 00:27:51 2008 From: sunhux at gmail.com (sunhux G) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 13:27:51 +0800 Subject: Summary: Will changing hostname affect Oracle10g, ssh etc Message-ID: <60f08e700803302227g770a7b7dxb0d7945ad7ba89a9@mail.gmail.com> Many thanks to Pedro & Brian's extensive answers & the others (Stan, Tim, Ioan, Peter). a) tnsnames.ora, listener.ora have to be taken care of but if they uses hostname/FQDN from DNS/hosts table, then it will be taken care of when updated in DNS/hosts. In our case, alas, DBA had hardcoded the IP address in these files so we'll have to edit them accordingly b) /etc/net/* are obsoleted in Solaris 10 c) best not to change the hostname & instead change the login prompt or terminal program's color scheme/settings to help avoid logging into the wrong server d) don't change the hostname to minimize amount of changes on the day of cutover e) do a search for the hostname and IP string in the application directories U On 3/28/08, sunhux G wrote: > > Hi > > Apologies if this should have been posted in an Oracle > /other lists. > > Just bought a T5120 running Solaris 10 & a colleague > would like a temporary hostname be given to the host > & on the day this server goes live, change the hostname > to the ultimate production hostname. > > Questions are : > Will changing hostname affect Oracle10g, Ssh, HP Data > Protector agent (/opt/aworks/agents/bin/hpaAgent) & a > Liebert UPS agent ("/opt/MultiLink/bin/LiebertM" daemon) > or do we need to reinstall these software after changing > hostname & IP addr? > > The steps involved in changing hostname (excluding IP addr) > are quite tedious : > /etc/hosts (/etc/inet/hosts) > /etc/nodename > /etc/hostname.*interface* > /etc/net/ticlts/hosts > /etc/net/ticots/hosts > /etc/net/ticotsord/hosts > /etc/inet/ipnodes > /etc/nodename > > and rename directory under /var/crash > # cd /var/crash > # mv oldname newname > Use "hostname newname" to change the hostname > on the fly (so don't have to reboot server). > > > My view is it's fair to use a temporary IP address (so tt > the old & new servers are on the same LAN for ease > of transferring files/data from old to new server) & on > the day of going live, change the IP addr to actual > production addr but my colleague still would like to use > a temporary hostname to avoid confusion (in case we > login to the wrong server). > > > Thanks for your inputs, > U _______________________________________________ sunmanagers mailing list sunmanagers at sunmanagers.org http://www.sunmanagers.org/mailman/listinfo/sunmanagers